I don't know, but the assumption that because a ministry finishes up after 10 years it has failed, seems to me to be a flawed starting point. I know none of the circumstances, so can't speak specifically, but it seems to me that this sort of thinking stops people from trying new things. Running something for 10 years can be exactly what a ministry has been conceived to do.

As someone who's been around the "church thing" for more years than I care to dwell on, it seems to me that what we see in the Axis example (and I totally realize this may come off sounding judgmental) is a simple case of focusing our attention on the wrong "gods." Specifically, there are many, many churches today - and I'm not convinced Willow was the first to wander down this road - just the most visible - who have felt that lacking of certain age groups in their fellowship and in response to that need, decided that the BEST or RIGHT way to help would be to "speak to" the different generations in "ways they can relate to." This sounds so good on the surface - even Paul told us to be all things to all people, right? However - when this is ALL we do - and this become the THRUST of our focus, then we have actually created "another god" which is idolotry.

I have no idea for certain what the various age groups were that made up the EARLY church. I assume there were people of various ages who were part of our first Christian gatherings. This just makes sense to me. And when you go back to ACTS and read HOW these people "did church" you get a very different picture from how WE tend to "do church" today... and if you want to talk about church growth results, then take a peek at Acts 2:42-47... oddly enough, without any hoopla, without all the snaz and pizazz, many people came to a saving relationship with Jesus Christ on a daily basis! Why? Because the DRAW was the life-transforming power of Jesus Christ through the outpouring of the Holy Spirit in their midst. That's it.

Honestly, I think that until our churches remain FOCUSED on the presence of Christ in the power of the Holy Spirit, it doesn't matter WHAT we have to offer - eventually, it will fade - and die.

I agree with Geoff's post regarding the myopic way we tend to define success or failure. The fact that something ends after a decade says very little--"What did it accomplish during that decade?" is the real question. I'm not familiar with the ministry say maybe it didn't achieve much of what is set out to do. In any case, Willow should be commended for its continued pursuit of innovation. Most churches would be fortunate to "fail" like Willow.

I also agree with Dan that creating what is essentially a brand extension (e.g. new ministry) does not fundamentally alter the DNA of the organization. As Dan points out, as long as the big decisions are dictated by leaders from the Mother Church, the new ministry will be on a relatively short leash. Short leashes do not generally lead to the radical structural transformation many of us agree is needed to reach a rapidly changing world. The church doesn't need new eye shadow or lipstick, it needs plastic surgery.

Without any intention to debate, I do have to say to Dan that your appeal to Acts 2 actually pulls out the rug from under you. It was the sign of the tongues accompanied by the message that brought the Jews over to hear the gospel (via signs), and ultimately to salvation (via the message). Willow Creek is trying to do the same in this culture by presenting the signs (be they non-miraculous) with the message of the Gospel.

But I do agree with you on your last point: "...until our churches remain FOCUSED on the presence of Christ in the power of the Holy Spirit, it doesn't matter WHAT we have to offer - eventually, it will fade - and die."

If we were living fifty years ago, it would be a fair assessment to say that Axis' ten-year-run was a failure. But in our present culture that is changing so quickly, it's not a fair statement. Ten years is a long time.

I do, however, think that Dan is on to something when we writes about aesthetic changes not touching the value shifts of a new culture. Yet when so many who have lived through the "contemporary" movement define and see change in terms of these superficial, aesthetic changes, we can expect to see some problems when the Church is faced with deeper ecclesiological and missiological shifts.

I personally have a deep concern that so many "contemporary church" pastors and leaders have jumped on a new wagon of ecclessiology under an incorrect assessment. There is a huge void in these contemporary mega-churches that they have defined as 18-30 year-olds. They want to reach them on a grand mega-church scale. So many have run out to buy everything Rob Bell is putting out. "Read what Rob is doing so that we can do it too." "Put some Nooma videos in our worship; that will reach them." Mars Hill is a big church, and mega-church pastors are, I fear, seeing Rob as a new Bill Warren or Rick Hybels. Dan is right in that reaching a new culture that transcends generational lines takes more than videos, candles, music, and art. It takes a fresh vision seen through new lenses. It's time to recapture the creativity of the Imago Dei and stop worrying about who's working what model.

I agree with Dan that style on its own will never keep people in church. But when he refers to "rethinking everything as any missionary would", I wonder about the successful missionaries of past generations who only learned to speak the language of the people but then brought the exact gospel message that they would preach in their own country. Without dressing like natives, or participating in any pagan rituals, they brought the simple message of man's initial sin, the need for repentance and God's gracious salvation. And guess what, people got saved. We need to remember that culture and style change, but people never do, sin never does and God never does. It is the moving of the Holy Spirit in a person's heart that brings them to salvation and God allows us to participate in the glory of that; but we need to always remember that it is His work alone.

Thanks to Dan for a thought provoking article. He may be right in suggesting that the demise of Axis is attributable to an inability to fully embrace postmodern ministry...but I can't help but wonder if anyone is really "reaching" the 18-30 demographic? Even emerging churches that have made the shift are relatively small communities. Perhaps reaching folks my age is more complicated than just embracing a new paradigm?

I may have thoughts later about the question at hand: why?

But for now, I would like to publicly express my sadness. Like Dan, thoughout the years I have known many members of the Axis team. This news makes me quite sad.

Let's pray for all of us trying to reach younger generations for Christ.

The late Dave Morsey of Southern California was a incredible man who I did not know well but who had much influence on me. Besides being a public school teacher for many years, he was an associate pastor who would read the Scriptures from his Greek N.T. translating as he went, later founded a small seminary in L.A. and ended up as president of an electronics company in the late 60's early 70's. On Wednesday night he would leave the company after a days work, drive 150 miles to Santa Barbara to a steak house and then give a Bible study to the hippies who showed up PLUS buying their meals. He wore his business suit, tie and wingtips as he taught from the Scriptures. I believe he did this for a few years.

Godly man in a suit, tie, short haircut and wingtips teaching to a room full of hippies. A real message from an honest man. Surely the free meal drew them but the message he taught kept them. Lesson: You don't have to be a Gen X wannabe to reach Gen X.

I want to ask a question that will seem ignorant but I think needs to be asked, if nothing else then to challenge our assumptions.

Are 18-30's "searching" in anywhere near the numbers that 30-50's are?

Of course we all know our share of counter examples,(sometimes even ourselves at that age)but knowing a good number of 18-30's that are looking for God, even having one of those rare churches that's filled with them, doesn't signify that we live in a culture where 18-30's are generally seeking in the numbers that 30-50's are.

None of us can accept missing an entire generation, but neither can we miss recognizing that the differences that may be leaving our ministries impotent. Perhaps the answer Dan Kimball is hinting at is true, that the culture we are dealing with is a different bird all together?

Personally I hope not.

I'm one of the hundreds, if not thousands of lives that have been touched by the Axis ministry at Willow Creek while it existed. Let's remember before we try to go too deep into second-guessing what could or couldn't have been done, that the Axis service itself dissolved, but the main focus of the Axis Ministry is connection anc community-building for Willow Creek's twenty-something population. Axis itself isn't a "failure"; it's merely changed form, and because it has, has the opportunity to touch even more lives than it did by organized services.

Great article, but I think AXIS is a clear example of program driven ministry verse process driven ministry. People don't buy into programs...they want to see life take shape through a process. The ending of AXIS is a sad day for Willow Creek, I know they loved this ministry and the results they brought. However, it is a happy day for the church, today, is a new day, and a new day is a day more dependent on God's leading then the day before.
Look forward to see the next steps Willow takes.

There were a couple of "Dans" mentioned in the previous comments... I had to go back and find out which "Dan" I was... LOL... anyway, as far as my comments about Acts... I guess I have to lovingly disagree with the commentor who said this pulls the rug out from what I am saying. I'm not going to get into a big thing here about tongues because, besdies music styles, homosexuality and abortion, tongues continues to ALSO divide the body of Christ. Bottom line - the passage I was referring to (and should have made this more clear) is Acts 2:42-47 where there is not only no mention of tongues, but the DRAW was the life-chaning presence of Christ in the power of the Holy Spirit as revealed through the exercising of people's spiritual gifts ie: mercy, help, teaching, prayer, etc. This free expression of gifts in the body is what LED (or drew) people into those early churches - it was not only or merely "the gift of tongues."

And, to be honest, I'm not sure how this might pull the rug out from what I stated...

One more comment regarding HOW we "reach" the younger generations...

When I was a teen (man, that sounds old, huh?) - I grew up in the era of the Jesus Movement, Youth Musicals, etc. So there was a lot of "speaking to my generation" going on via songs and worship gatherings that looked NOTHING like what the older generations were experiencing. BUT THAT IS NOT WHY I CAME TO CHRIST! In fact, if I am honest about it, there were very few "truly worshipful moments" that I encountered in the midst of those concerts and theatrical musical shows. Don't hear me wrong - I LOVED that music and those WAYS of singing songs to the Lord. In many ways, I still do... HOWEVER - - the reason I came to know the Lord is because a man named Chris spent TIME with me, and cared about me, and then led me to a relationship with Jesus - just one and one - no music, no hoopla - it was a RELATIONSHIP that did it.

I think, today, far too many churches spend WAY too much energy on "creating a great God show" because they THINK this is the RIGHT WAY to "reach" younger people for Christ. In some ways, it is a lot easier to put on a great God show than it is to actually get in your car and go spend time with someone, getting to know them, which can take years, and then letting them see by YOUR lifestyle, that a relationship with Jesus Christ actually MEANS something... If we truly want to reach younger people for the Kingdom, perhaps we should spend the same energy we spend on creating media shout presentations on TIME WITH another person... you know, just to see what happens...

This is just one more method of "Chasing Down People" to come to church. Willowcreek and Axis are victims of themselves. In every area of life people seem to have the capacity to conform to some reasonable level of adult behavior but when it comes to church, suddenly we get out the diapers and baby food and are intent on keeping them where they never grow past soiling their diapers.

At best Axis was a tool (not one I would use) and a marketing scheme. So, Willowcreek is asking God for a new vision (which means they lay at God's feet the original vision of Axis). It is nice that God gives new visions when old ones don't seem to work out. Hey, here is an idea, maybe the vision wasn't from God and it was a markeing idea dreamed up by some men and women!

Dan wrote: "I guess I have to lovingly disagree with the commentor who said this pulls the rug out from what I am saying."

I agree with you Dan - that I'm not sure it pulls the rug from under your statement...but I also see more happening in Acts than simple preaching of the word. At Pentecost - the apostles amazingly began speaking in a variety of languages and reached a great number of people. Paul and Peter focused on different groups of people and used different styles...same message, different styles.

Perhaps part of the problem is the popular view of ecclesiology in America. We've become a church in America that is obsessed with Sunday morning gatherings...we expect sheep to come to the pen. One problem with this model is that we cannot be all things to all people. Nor should we try to be. We'll burn out.

Most churches understand that they're one generation from death...hence the focus on 18 to 30 year olds. Someone raised the question - is this younger age group reachable? at least to the extent that older generations are? These are good questions.

Complicating this environment is what I believe is a growing divide in worldviews - and it's bigger than merely a generational thing. Postmodern thinkers don't connect with modern arguments - and vice versa. So trying to reach postmodern people in a modern church model (i.e. axis within willow) is bound to lead to tension.

This raises another question - if the 18 to 30 age group is reachable (which I believe they are) - will they connect within our existing churches?

Perhaps the answer lies in recognizing and developing the free use of gifts so that we can indwell our communities, families and workplaces - rather than trying to draw people to Sunday morning services. Don't get me wrong - I love my church and our Sunday morning services - but I wonder if it will reach the people on my heart - 20-40 year olds who don't have a church background.

I think Dan was getting at the idea that "church-within-church" is not true change.

For too long, evangelical churches have gone after the latest greatest technology/fad thinking that will be the savior. We've come to find that there is such a much deeper cultural shift and more specifically worldview shift taking place.

Twentysomethings have gone to the Scriptures, traveled around the world and they don't hear or see the Jesus or church of the Scriptures in any of these mega-super associations.

People want to know what the emerging church movement/conversation is...well it is asking and working through those deep questions most churches ignore.

It's funny - I have gone back and forth on this issue/topic over the years... sometimes I feel like whatever it takes to get them in, do it. Other times I wonder if, as the previous commentor suggests, we're not actually hindering those well-intentioned efforts. I don't really mind communicating the truth of the gospel in ways that can be quickly understood by the recipient. I mean, this is ONE reason (not THE reason) that contemporary praise songs have had so much meaning for so many people - because they don't have to stumble over all the thees, thous, fetters and ebineezers along the way. They can QUICKLY connect with the Lord in song - well - kinda like we see in the Psalms. (Someone is going to say that we need to educate people as to what those archaic words mean - and let me just flat out say that I don't agree with that viewpoint.) Okay, moving on... My personal peeve with many of the "creative" worship "events" (formerly called church) is that they don't ever truly move ON FROM that baby-food place (as someone said earlier.) I know the intention is to "eventually" bring the gospel - however - in many cases, you simply have, as I call it, a wonderful "God Show" every week that I'm sure helps people think about God at some level - - but is this truly, really the kind of worship encounter our Lord desires with us? My gut tells me "no."

"Victims of ourselves"? I have to admit that I'm from Willow Creek myself so I'm just a little biased. However, I simply don't think any of us are doing justice to God, Willow Creek, or any of ourselves to second-guessing why the staff chose to dissolve the Axis service.
Not doing justice to God? That might sound a little weird, but I'm thinking that if we continue to second-guess this and take the attitude that Axis itself is completely gone, as in the title of the blog entry, "What we should learn from the demise of Willow's Next-Gen Ministry", we're forgetting that there's still important work for Him to do in Axis's reconstituted form. It's a little like saying, "Well, God' can't work here anymore". Maybe that's too big of a stretch, but let's please remember that as people change, so do methods for reaching them. It's not fair to say that just because a vision has changed form, that it wasn't even a vision to start with.
We aren't doing justice to ourselves, either. We're merely chasing our own tails, instead of looking into the future. God can and does use things that appear like failures to strengthen His people and bring more of them into the Kingdom. We forget that when we second-guess things like this.
And we aren't doing justice to Willow Creek, either. Calling Axis a "marketing scheme" is an unnecessary insult, and it's really counterproductive. It really makes Willow Creek, who has and is making huge inroads for the Kingdom, look driven by statistics instead of God's strength. That simply isn't true. Please remember this.

A famous? preacher sat on the platform waiting his turn to share, he listened to all the other speakers go on and on, when it was his turn he stood up and quietly said, "Jesus loves me this I know," then he sat down.

That is all people need to know, that Jesus loves them and The Holy Spirit will do the rest.

The Lord said to His followers, and this applies to all speakers, Pastors, "Feed my sheep" just do it from His word, not what you THINK young people need.

Programs come and programs go, so does the wind, the rain and the snow, but The Word of The Lord SHALL stand for ever.

Just from an Australian perspective and having read enough Gen X and emergent blogs over the last several years I would add a couple of things. First I would say "Its not about the service". The service is an event-based Christianity that is in part celebration, conference, corporate worship etc but is in the end an event....not New Testament "church". So tinkering with style is merely adjusting the style for an attractional ministry. Consequently I would argue there's a bgger story to be told re: becoming missional to postmoderns.

Another thought is that the current leadership is still retained by Baby Boomers (mentioned above) that have been trained up in a world view that is simply passing away for many many people. There needs to be a recognition for a 'mixed economy' for Christian community. There seems to be really only one model of 'success' in the church. I think more can be achieved outside the walls of structure with postmoderns, so if a 'service' still even occurs, it is an 'extra' to real church. Rather than being the main event, the service is regarded as something else.

And perhaps last I would offer that church is an answer community that doesn't allow for the deeper journey of question which postmoderns are intrinsically wired for....questions imply doubt rather than a certainty of faith which seems to be the goal.

"Nothing really changes, everything remains the same." How do we forget this? Our culture may be changing, but the people aren't. They are sinners, only saved by grace. They still need one-on-one discipleship, compassion and love. In the age of the megachurch we've become very good at packaging fraternity, but very poor at ministering Jesus. Maybe we see ourselves as sitting at the Sermon of the Mount, or feeding the thousands, but we often miss that Jesus spent most of his time hanging with Peter and John.

Good Morning everyone,

I have a question for everyone, one that has been rattling around in my brain for quite a while actually. Why do we need to come up with "fresh" ways of doing things? Why not do what has been working for over 2'000 years? Why not simply proclaim Christ? Why do we need to rethink the whole paradym; are we not making it more complicated than it is?

I have seen more people come to Christ when I simply give them the plain, "dusty", "boring", straight from the hip truth. I have seen far less come to Christ because of some fancy-smancy, high-tech, in your face, top-of-the-line programs. Whatever happened to just living out our lives in humbleness and Godly obedience and just proclaiming Christ wherever we go? Its not that hard folks!! We are making this whole evangelism thing to hard. Peter and Paul saw thousands come to Christ without having to have a new paradym, a new program, a new way of doing church, or by embracing the worldview of that day (just read Acts 17 and you will see that Paul actually stood against the worldviews of people and did not affirm them).

Just a thought everyone. Why not just simply proclaim Christ?! People are dying without him because we are so busy with trying to be either emergent, or postmod, or revevant!! Just be like Christ!!

Not having attended Willow Creek, or the Axis service, I don't know what made the "Axis" service different from the other services--but it seems clear that the original vision came out of a realization that the traditional practices in Willow Creek's services did not connect with Next-Gen worshippers. And if we want our church services to be places of celebration, of learning, of sharing burdens, it's certainly valid to ask if the things we do in our services invite everyone to participate in those things.

If Willow Creek's new vision is to be inter-generational, then just dissolving the Axis service and giving them a designated seating section in the old service isn't really being intergenerational. I'm curious how they intend to not only bring Next-Gen worshippers into fellowship with the rest of their congregation, but also bring their congregation into fellowship with the Axis folks who are joining them. If they are really continuing to welcome Next-Genners, then business as usual in the old services are going to result in the same problem they had before they started Axis.

Either that, or else they've come to the realization that there wasn't anything fundamentally different about the Axis service, in which case Dan Kimball is right: church-within-a-church ministries are too often just superficial modifications of the old model, not truly missional or groundbreaking.

There are seasons of ministry and the season for Axis is over. It's that simple. I've always felt that DNA of the church depends on the environment in which you are placed. Willow Creek is nothing like Fellowship Church (Ed Young, Jr) which is nothing like the storefronts around the corner from me. The main thing should still be the proclamation of the gospel. Kudos to the leadership for having the courage to listen to God.

K

I have seen a number of generation-based church services dissolve (a better word than "fail," I think), and often I think it comes down to a combination of misplaced motivation.

Running a ministry is a lot of work. Modern, youth-oriented ministry tends to involve more work than more traditional services. Instead of a pianist, you have a whole band, which requires a leader to organize it and hold practice sessions. Hymnals are replaced with visually interesting slideshows, which can require hours to put together (and find just the right edgy animation to play beneath the lyrics to that new worship song). Often, the entire service is "choreographed" for perfect timing.

All of these new tasks requires more people to perform them, and the new people need someone to organize them. The senior staff becomes either overworked, as one or two people organize everything, or watered down, as so many people take charge that there is no consistent vision.

The end result: burnout. The band leader gets sick of all of the rehearsals. The PowerPoint guy doesn't want to give up his Saturday mornings every week to do the same slideshow over and over. The drama director gets so stressed out that nobody wants to work with them any more.

The only way I've seen to avoid this kind of burnout is to have the proper motivation: preaching the word of God and worshipping Him. The more complicated the service becomes, the easier it is to lose sight of the real reason for having church in the first place. Instead, it becomes a weekly civic theater production. Burned-out people rarely inspire others to come to Christ because it is all they can do to remain near Christ themselves.

There are exceptions. Some churches have just the right combination of people who have the right motives and the skills to pull it all together. However, there should be no pressure on other churches to imitate these successes. They should focus first on the needs of their community and congregation, not on their preferences.

Did Axis and Willow really miss the boat? From what I've read regarding the end of Axis and future Willow, Axis was a success in that in did change the DNA of Willow. It was a fresh, missional, holistic approach to following Jesus and because of that the look of Willow Creek is now different and more in line with current generations of "seekers" and "followers." We're so quick to judge and figure out a way to prove the errors of current megachurches that we miss they're rather healthy ability to change and adapt the presentation and methods. Willow Creek has evolved along with the current generation of spiritual sojourners and that is due to the influence of what Axis sought to achieve. Axis didn't fail or die, it fundamentally changed the approach Willow Creek took as a whole. It made its reason to exist unneccessary as Willow Creek now more robustly reaches those on a spiritual journey at different levels and within different generations while also more effectively taking the love of Jesus to the world in more tangible and outward focus ways. I say the lesson is that Axis was effective, and Willow's leadership should be applauded for recognizing its effectiveness and the shortcomings in the larger Willow gatherings and methodologies and making the larger changes they have made. But that's just me...

It seems to me that whenever a culture is in a period of major transition, as American culture has been these past few decades, "new" and "fresh" ideas come and go. Much like the early scouts searching for new trails to new horizons, they help point the way to something no one can yet see or describe. A place we know we need to get to but a place that has not yet been discovered.

In twenty years we'll all be experts on the so called success and failure of AXIS or any other transitional ministry. For now, we must seek the Lord in prayer, obey what we hear, and learn as we move upward and forward.

Our problem is believing that the latest success story is the final version. Glad Apple computer didn't stop when they produced the first Macintosh...

Generational ministries have never really worked at any time. As a Youth For Christ worker my converts stopped faith at the end of High School. It was not until I as church based and multi generational that I saw a higher retention rate and a better outreach to the families of the youth that i was working with. We need the 90 year olds to model that church is not about them, it is about those who are not in the pews yet. When I 16 or 25 year old sees a 92 year old accepting them as they are and their music they in turn will listen to the music and the ideas of the 92 year old. Community is always a mix of youth young adults adults and old we need each other. The sooner we realize that the better.

I have never attended Willow Creek but I know ithas been influential on a lot of churches nationwide, as has FellowShip Church(Ed Young Jr.). I was saved at fellowship church Aug 18, 2001. And a big part of the reason I was reached was the format of the service. Contemporary praise and worship followed by a great message that explained the gospel to me in a way I had never heard before. The point I am trying to get to is that many many people are being brought to Jesus through Fellowship Church and churches like it, of which I will be eternally grateful.

I'm a bit disturbed by the tone of many of the responses to this article. It's easy to bash style and methodology. It's easy to claim that Jesus wouldn't have ministered that way. But the truth is that we all are tasked with relating the gospel to the particular culture we're in without compromising truth. The culture in South Barrington, Illinois is much different than it is here in Sodaville, Oregon. Let Willow Creek do whatever they feel God leads them to do in reaching the people of their area for Jesus Christ. Do what God calls you to do in your area, for your culture. The world looks at our division and laughs. Let's show them our love for one another and unity in the Spirit. Then maybe they'll start listening, both in Oregon and in Illinois and all over the world.

Generational ministries are great for getting people in the door. The problem within them is twofold: they seem contradictory to what the church is called to be, and it's difficult to keep people connected to the church once they have outgrown their ministry. As a youth pastor I faced this constantly before finally realizing that I'd been trying to connect kids to the youth ministry and had failed them because that was all they knew. Being the church means we are all connected to one another and Christ, and I'm glad to see that is becoming more obvious for more churches.

Ten years ago "18-30 year-olds" were different from today's 18-30 year-olds. So perhaps what we are seeing is not a "failure" but merely the passing of a generation. Given what I see/read about that generation in today's culture I suspect that they need something very different from what the earlier generation needed. Perhaps that folks at Willow Creek sense this and may come up with a more appropriate mission strategy.

I agree Mark Martinson. We like the hype, we love to draw them in with the loud music, etc. It becomes a club more than anything else. It's good for the short run of things, but where are these people going to be in 20, 30, 40 years?

I know too many people that have invested a number of years within a ministry. That ministry ended, and now, as time passed, they are lukewarm in their faith at best. In most of their faces, I see no spark of the freedom in Christ they once knew and embraced. Is that the churches fault? I'm not so sure. Ultimately, we are responsible for the watering of our faith. And I can't blame anyone for giving their best, God-given shot with the tools that God gave them and blessed them with. But God's grace covers a multitude of short comings, does it not?

I for one allowed myself to be one of those types of people: The pastor left, the sheep scattered, and I decided to quit. Quitting got me into all kinds of mischief. Lukewarm at best, ice-cold at my worst. But God...Wow! His grace is sufficient for me. Time has and still is healing those wounds that I afflicted upon myself. Praise God.

I pray God's peace, mercy, and grace upon all at Axis, Willow Creek, and many others like them.

I am typing this from Willow. Many of my friends serve in the Axis ministry and it has been a trying but growing time for them. But, when you have an avg. attendence of 300 or so, and many staff to support it, AND your primary speaker has taken another job, things need to be reassessed. Rather than get into all that, let me make a few observations:

Why do we tend to think of success as something that continues ad infinitum? Why can't churches (or gatherings) pop up here and there, live for a while and morph into some other thing or things?

The church is people. Many people connected with Axis have gone other places to do other things and have affected way more people than if they would have stayed here. So, in a way, Axis has grown.

As Kimball mentioned, the church within a church model is difficult at best, and is further confounded the less it refers to itself as such. In this age of tech, why do we need "mother" churches to house and fund new ministries, especially when the target of a new ministry is people outside of the "mother" churchs demographic. The 3M company is a leader in inventions, think Post-it, among others. They form new companies to start new things and give them automomy and funding. This can be only a formal procedure in some cases, but in theirs, it seems to have contributed to great success, and even created products that were not even the original goal.

Willow will adopt a new strategy, Im sure. It will be a good one for most people. But many other strategies will be needed to deal with this generation and the next. Sometimes something must die to give birth to something new, funny how our whole religion is based on that same premise.

This is quite interesting... Having attended Axis several times, I can tell you that it seemed to me like a youth group meeting for young adults. The philosophy seemed to be "lets entertain them, give them some watered-down "relevant message" (not too much though because we don't want them to be bored and heaven-forbid that we might speak too much truth which might offend), make sure you have lattes available, and promote with a slick Willow marketing campaign... Thank God he delivered me from this foolishness!

Then I visited Harvest Bible Chapel pastored by James MacDonald in Rolling Meadows. As a Gen-Xer, my life has forever been changed by the simple, no-holds-barred, exegetical approach of Harvest. I've since moved from the Chicago area and I am delighted to know that a Harvest Bible Chapel may be planted in my area within the next year. Praise God because it has been hard finding a church now that there are so many Willow Creek, watered-down clones that have spread across the landscape of our country today. God have mercy.

Just a note - I am on vacation so I am trying not to get involved emotionally in any blog conversation - but I just looked and wanted to express that I personally have never attended Axis, but I have attended Willow Creek several times. In my personal experience there I never felt anything at all was "watered down" as the last comment expressed (especially in the mid-week New Community gathering that I went to twice). I have also listened to Axis messages and didn't feel anything was watered down either, but they were carefully speaking to a certain group for a specific purpose. There were other options they had for deeper study if one desired it.

I get very discouraged when I see believers in Jesus making very negative comments about other specific people or specific ministries - especially with certain tones and what I would consider poor attitudes. It is easy to poke at negative things in churches or ministries you may not agree with, and I try to repent when I catch myself ever doing that.

This post was not intended to be any form of stirring up and venting negativity towards churches you don't agree with. But discussing the difficulties of intergenerational ministry and the alternative worship gatherings that are usually great-hearted attempts of seeing emerging generations learn about Jesus - and thanking Willow and Axis for their attempts and pioneering efforts (as I expressed in Part 2 of the post).

Dan

I'm sorry, but the key to evangelizing to, converting, and retaining "young adult" membership is to teach them and pound into their head that the greatest commandments is to "Love the Lord your God" and "Love your neighbor as yourself." Trying to keep the "college and career" sheep with entertainment and such superficial drivel will fail once the gimmicks wear off. The fault is not what the church has to offer the 18-35 year olds. Its what the church is teaching them. I see it all the time in my friends, when the supposedly "strongest young adult Christians to have moved into the area" jump from church to church, not accountable to anyone, but involved in almost every "Christian college event" between churches, with the only truthful excuse being "I couldn't find a girlfriend at such-and-such church." Definitely shortsighted and need to learn the "seek ye first the kingdom/righteousness of God, and everything else will be granted unto you" of dedication, surrender, and servanthood as God's people.
What needs to happen is that these C&C kids need to GROW UP and be adults. God: first, girlfriend: 9th, self-entertainment: near-dead-last.

There is still one problem that needs to be addressed. That is that most churches have great youth, children and family programs but where do you fit in post High school and pre-minivan. Most churches are missing the 18-30 crowd. You can rally all you want against new methods and call them fads and gimmicks, but is the alternative working at reaching young people. Have you as an older person mentored the next generation apart from a flannel graph latley. I agree that there are lessons to be learned and growing pains to be endured, but it is no different than when churches adopted Youth Ministry as a mission in the 70's and 80's. The key is we need to reach young adults that are making crucial, life altering decisions. And we need to build multi-generational relationships. One of the reasons we are in this boat is because these young people have never had real parents and real families. Including the church. I am the pastor of a "church within a church" and I can tell you two things for sure. 1. We are reaching people that were not reached before. 2. We NEED spiritual mothers, fathers, grandma's and Grandpa's, and we need them now. We need to be able to address cultural shifts and give them spiritual roots. Now you wonder why this is getting messy. Most churches don't want to or don't know how to handle these two issues.