I agree to a point. However, to tell people to stay and work for change doesn't sit well when their churches and the leadersare happy with the status quo, and simply aren't listening. How long does one remain in a dysfunctional church, talking to him- or herself?

The problem with all this is that many emerging church folk and "new faithful" orthodoxy types have been kicked out of their evangelical/free church traditions. Many twentysomethings who grew up in these evangelical traditions are seeing how thoroughly saturated consumerist-captialism has taken over as the mission of the church, they (and myself) have found they cannot be faithful to the calling of God and the Missio Dei by supporting those systems.

Another way of looking at is in God's continual reformation of his people, in which he continually starts new movements from the fringes (e.g. the people who are kicked out or not welcomed to begin with like Edwards who was never welcomed in the Anglican "steeple churches" and Whitefield who was welcomed, but went for the free spirit revivalism of the first awakening). The emerging church movement has too often not been recognized as an ecumenical movement. In many ways it is a movement that can embrace and draw from the deep traditions of the church, extending to Orthodoxy-Roman Catholicism-to-Pentecostalism.

Over time all of the new moves of God become fully institutionalized and God through the Spirit moves afresh. I personally grew up Foursquare (pentecostal/holiness) which began as a revivalistic and interdenominatioal church with a focus on global evangelism. Today Foursquare could not be farther from those roots and as a result is seriously incoherent in both written and practiced theology.

Perhaps we ought to stop and think that the Mission of God does not hinge in man made institutionalism and God is free to move beyond ivory tower churches. Certainly this has been God's character going back to the first temple!

I feel like Larry did on an earlier comment when he said he agreed to a point. I think it depends on why someone is leaving. Many people church shop because they can't find a church that's exactly the way they want it. These folks often never find a church home because they haven't figured out that the perfect church doesn't exist. Well, technically I guess it could exist until you put some people in it.
On the other hand we have to recognize that churches are closing their doors at a rate this country has never seen in its history because something isn't keeping the existing people there, and something is keeping new people out. As Christians we just cannot deny that the church as we have known it in this country is in trouble. Could it be that the churches unwillingness to change is keeping it from reaching a changing world. Not changing the Word of God mind you, but making God's Word relevant to a changing world.
I recently had the opportunity to hear Bill Hybels speak at a conference in Dallas. He was talking about his father who he said was amazingly successful in business but never really made and impact on the world. Pastor Hybels said that his dad never made an impact because he never went to a church who had a vision big enough to get his dads attention and challenge him to join it.
If you have a vision from God to be a part of a movement to reach a broken world and the church you're attending isn't doing that in a real and impacting way, then you have two choices. Find a church that's a part of the movement you're called to, or try to help change the church your at. To be perfectly honest I haven't seen many people who have been successful at the second option and most of the time it's not that persons job to change the vision anyway.
When it's all said and done you have to be honest and ask yourself why you're really leaving the church your at. If it's selfish then I completely agree with the writer, but if it's because you want to join a church that is doing everything it can to reach a broken world, then I must humbly disagree with the writer. I don't believe God would ask anyone to not pursue their God given purpose for the sake of tradition.

I am sorry to say but this is the most absurd argument I have heard in a long time.

As you are aware protestants are returning to the Catholic Church in droves. You can hear or watch many of these conversion stories online at EWTN.com on a program called The Journey Home. Most all of them state that conversion back to the Church was no longer a "choice" for them--it would be disobedience if they failed to convert.

What you fail to see is that we were all once Catholic. For 1500 years there was only the Catholic Church! So why don't we all return where we started! Wouldn't it serve Christ better if we were all in one Church so that we could work for the good of the Church that Christ started and promised that the gates of Hell would not prevail against it??
http://www.realclearreligion.com

This is a pointed issue for me, having over the last few years gone through the process of leaving the denomination I grew up in (and had found Christ there ) and joined a new church.

This was not easy for me, in large part because ecumenism is a very important value for me. I came to realize that while loyalty and stability are important values, they are not the only ones and sometimes it is OK for other issues to predominate.

For quite a while I felt as if I were divorcing my old church. The guilt was strong. A while later, I thought that lots of young adults change their family relationships, not through divorce but through marriage. Maybe that's the better way to think of this. We grow up in one family, with our parents and siblings, and that does a huge part to shape who we are and you always love them and are grateful for that (yes not everyone grows up in healthy families but bear with the illustration, please) and then when you grow up you form a new family. It's not a rejection of the old, but the next stage in your faith life.

Canonically, of course, this does not work even a little bit. But it makes some sense to me.

Most of my friends do not understand why this was a difficult process. "Oh, it doesn't matter. They're all the same!" I don't think that's a valuable approach, and I cannot understand my friends who regularly cycle through various churches after several months in each, continually looking for the best fit. But neither do I think we should consider ourselves to be locked into one tradition because that's where we were baptized as newborns (or newborn Christians for the believer-baptism advocates among us). Rootedness and stability and permanence and working to make things better rather than picking up and leaving are all valuable things. But don't hold me to a commitment made when someone dribbled water on my head when I was three days old.

Another benefit to David's proposal is learned submission to the community that has formed us. Perhaps at the times we most feel like it is time for something new/deeper/more theological/more applicable/more relevant, we should remember the local community of faith that has nurtured us to that point. Submission to that community may be the best vaccination against the consuming mentality that opposes the ecumenism David (and many of us) hopes for.

Staying put may be an option if you're church hopping on stylistic grounds...but what about serious theological and faith-based reasons to leave one's beginnings? Beginnings are not always where we end up: we don't counsel ex-Wiccans or Hindus to stay put and "seek to be faithful and trust the Spirit to work where God has put us!" If there are legitimate, God-inspired reasons to leave, by all means, follow the Spirit.

For me, it also depends on why a person is leaving. I grew up in a strict fundamentalist culture, where women were barred from doing anything in church other than teaching children. Now my views on that issue have completely changed, and I feel much more comfortable in a church that matches my views.

Ironically, my husband has made the opposite journey than that mentioned in the opening post. For most of his adult life, he attended a very liturgical church. A couple of years ago, however, he started to get restless. He felt that he simply wasn't growing spiritually at this church, because they seemed to put too much emphasis on ritual and not enough on reaching the wider world. Now we both feel much more at home in a charismatic type of church.

This seems to be a both/and issue. It is both good for us to stay in our denominations of origin to shape them and work for good in them. And it is good for us to leave and be faithful to our own calling and convictions if we have sufficiently exhausted our recourses for such beliefs within that denomination. I have come back to the denomination of my birth because I feel called to work for change their. But, I recognize that many friends I have had within this denomination exhausted themselves working for change and were unable to continue there and still worship and seek God faithfully. Maybe staying put is the better of the two goods, but it is not always possible, even if they haven't kicked you out. Maybe it is more faithful to pack up and leave rather than cause division and force them to give you the boot.

A pastor once told me that if "spirit of G-d got up and walked out of this church, I would follow it out cause there is no reason to stay."
Later, oddly enough, this was the same pastor who invited me to leave after I mentioned to him that I think the church was heading down the wrong path, scripturally.
After leaving, and I was going through a period of spiritual depression, the church went through a horrible split. One pastor quit the ministry altogether, another went to form his own church, and the one pastor who invited me to leave went down a path that I can only describe as pseudo-Christian-gee-this-is-new-age-like-theology. Needless to say, I went to hear him speak one, and to put it bluntly, I would only go back to that church because it was a mission field to the lost.
So, there is a time to leave, and there is a time to stay...but when it becomes clear that the congregation as a whole has fled from G-d...well, what is there to be gained by staying?

There are times when God leads or instructs a person to join a church where their needs can be met i.e. A church whose youth ministry is strong, a church that addresses the needs of married couples. There is no scriptural ground for the advice given in this article.

Penevieve: You may not be going back far enough. For 400+ years before Catholicism, the church existed in a different yet vibrant form. If I am going back to my roots, I'd have to go back to Acts.

This is where I choose to stay and stand. I believe there are only 4 reasons to leave a church.

1. Heresy is taught
2. Immorality is condoned by inaction on the part of the leadership
3. Illegality: something illegal is being done and again, not addressed by the leadership
4. Unethical standards: are practiced and even encouraged.

Everything and anything else can be a wonderful opportunity to stay in order to learn and grow. As for having your needs net, I don't buy it. What about addressing needs that exist. Instead of pulling your children out for a church with a better program, why not create a good program where you are. Music? ditto. Youth group? ditto etc. etc.

A church in a town of 1000 people rarely has a "meet all needs church." But a church in a town of 100 can be a "we'd like to be a church that addresses all legitimate needs with the gospel."

For the record and to correct an earlier statement made by someone else, the Roman Catholic Church was not the only church for about 1500 years, the Eastern Orthodox Church existed too and they both mutually recognized one another though interestingly enough it was the East that has changed very little.

Also the Roman Catholic church is not the church Jesus started. It is the Church Constantine formed in the Roman Empire to bring order in the land. This made sense because for the first few hundred years the "early church" which met in small gathering places was getting the hell beat out of them because they bore witness to the Lordship of Christ, not the emporer (president) or the marketplace!

About this so-called "trend" of evangelicals becoming Catholic. I live in the Wheaton area, and my observation is that for every evangelical who becomes Catholic, there are ten or twenty former Catholics who discover a vibrant and personal faith in an evangelical church.

You're talking about a trickle to Catholicism, while the torrent is still the other direction.

I remember at age eighteen and not yet a Christian, feeling uncomfortable at the church I had begun to attend. I was attending to be near a particular girl. I felt uncomfortable (but never unwelcome) because the Gospel was being preached and I was resisting it.

Since my conversion, I have yet to feel uncomfortable in a church although I have made others uncomfortable at times by standing up for the Word of God in churches where the Gospel had been abandoned. And there are many of those.

Ecumenism is the broad path. The Word of God leads us down a narrow one.

Slight clarification on what Sam Andreas said - up until about 1054 the Catholics and the Orthodox were the same church. The system was collegial - many regionally-organized churches who shared one communion, one set of beliefs, and were equals, with one Patriarch (formerly of Rome, now of Constantinople), as the first among equals (though with no power whatsoever outside of his own jurisdiction). This is the way the Orthodox church is still run, while sadly the Catholics started going their own way, which led to the split, and to where the Catholics are today.

As to the article, I wish the author the best as he stays in his church, but I do agree that sometimes it just isn't possible. I've tried staying, but felt like I was dying because most people around me where more interesting in money or intellectual games than in God.

Sorry, but I need nourishment.

Don't worry too much about it. Most of them will probably end up becoming Buddhist somewhere along the line.

Switching denominations and religions is an established American custom and to decry it is to spit in the wind.

I have been focused for some two years now on the subtle challenge of having to part with my church of origin. This challenge is born out of the fact that the churches concern today seems to be lured and caught in the grips of living on past glories of past ministers, working for a living, administrative novelties, entrenched divide or distinction between the clergy and laity rather than working for towards the goals of the Kingdom. The ordinary testimony of the early church regarding daily conversions does not match up with what we a witnessing today. The establishment of the todays church will not listen to any still small voice and therefore pave the way for the exit of their members.

I'm afraid continuing attachment to the churches we were born into and having to put up a fight for a change is another nice idea but unfortunately is without any biblical basis. Could the patriach Abraham have stayed put and comfortable in Ur when The Lord was commanding him to go? When the fire is ablaze one cannot stay. It would be right to speak out and when it will not be heeded to one has to say a painfull good bye. That is the way the Luthers, Calvins, Wesleys and many more evangelicals and reformers took and how many of us dare say they were wrong! I think that is about the stage I've personally reached.

I understand people leave churches for theological disagreements. But don't you think most ordinary people leave for the reason that their needs are not met? Although I gave money for a large project, and attended church often, they never asked about my 2 sons, and did not visit me in the hospital. If a minister is not interested, concerned, and caring about me, why should I be faithful to that church?

I struggle with this idea of stay/leave too, and I have come across friends who have chosen to leave/stay for different reasons.

While I do agree that spiritual nourishment is something important and crucial, I feel uncomfortable about using it to justify one to leave his/her present church. I don't know why I feel uncomfortable - perhaps I have an idealistic view that church is about commitment, community and service rather than what 'I need'. Not that 'I need' is not important, but there are so many other ways that 'my needs' can be met - for instance, attending part-time theological college, one-on-one discipleship but the most important of all, our QT where we get our direct connection to God above. It might become an excuse to justify not challenging ourselves to hear God intimately.

I guess there are reasons why one should stay/leave but it all boils down to the reason. Am definitely not for church hopping because it shows a consumerism mindset to Christianity and nothing like what Christ has preached about service and discipleship.

Inward transformation. That's the key.

Does the OP object to people changing denominations if they change locations? I went to a non-denominational church growing up, then to an Apostolic church in University, then a Mennonite Brethren church after the next move and then to an Apostolic church after the next move and now attend a Mennonite church after the last move.

I have never left a church for any reason other than geographic (although I have considered it), but I have not been loyal to a specific denomination. I would think that the number of people whose church of origin is still 20 minutes from their house is in the vast minority. I also think that attending a church in your community is better than commuting to one, unless God specifically lays it on your heart. How can you invite friends and coworkers to your church/ to meet your Christian friends if they are all an hour drive away. I'm not in favour of the church shopping mentality, but i think people are going to come and go from churches a lot more than they used to, just because of our increased mobility.

I too, agree in part with this post. When leaving a church, we must never leave hastily because our motives must be pure (i.e. It must be clear through God's Word, people and circumstances in our lives to show us that it is indeed God "calling" us to move).

While I see that it would be ideal for all of us to stay in our churches of "origin," that is somewhat impractical as God gives every church leader/pastor a particular vision for the church he is called to lead. There is a time when an individual's personal clash with that vision must stop and the person needs to move on, accepting that there are many different ways to achieve the same end ... drawing people into the Kingdom and equipping them to go and teach others, thus multiplying disciples. Clearly, motive for leaving must be carefully considered.

The great awakening was about the gospel being preached with the Spirit's power and people joining the new churches as they got converted, not just because the older churches were boring. They had no life because they neglected the gospel. I ministered as an "evangelical-charismatic" missionary for 6 years in Roman Catholic Bavaria and let me tell you, they are extremely individualistic and narcissistic, as is German culture. They go to church a few times a year, all they do is hatch (infant baptism), match (weddings) and dispatch(funerals). They have no idea of the gospel but seem to be in love with the idea of Mary as a god. In Europe Roman Catholicism is a dead institution taking in church tax, and the priests are not involved in peoples lives. Most of those who give their lives to the Lord Jesus Christ in southern Germany join evangelical and charismatic churches. I thank God they leave the neglectful institution of Roman Catholicism. I think the superficiality of some churches in the States has more to do with the extremely materialistic and individualistic American culture than a thin theology, or in some cases the false theology of the prosperity gospel

I have read all the comments above and most seem to revolve around "ME" and "I". Where is God in all of this?? How about God's sovereignty, providence. How about God's will, and purpose. I agree with the article only in the part of unity, but I disagree that one should sit in a church and try to wait it out or influence changes. Subtle changes can sometimes be made, but when they are major changes, such as in Doctine and or Theological points of view, that could cause more harm than good.

Secondly, I have not heard much about prayer. Why not look to God, pray about the situation and then listen for His direction. I think that one of the main problems in the Christian Church today is conformity. We want things to be the way "I" like it, what can the church do to satisfy "ME". How can "We" get people to like "OUR" church. So the church tries to market themselves like a secular business. They want to conform to the ways of the world and please people. More people, more money, more money, the more things we can do to satisfy "Me" and please more people.

I have seen some of the poorest communities in Haiti, and South Africa that have nothing but GOD. And they have the most faith, love and more riches than any American Church I have ever seen. They know what it is like to suffer, to have pain, to be persecuted. Sounds a lot like the Apostle Paul's recordings doesn't it?

So my point, forget about "ME" and forget about "YOU", and put God back in the picture. Trust in His sovereignty, His Will and His purpose. God knows what He is doing. So if God is leading you away, then by all means listen and follow. If He is telling you to stay, then stay. Whatever choice you make will ultimately be a part of God's will and purpose.

We have gone through the soul tearing of leaving a church (contemporary style) I had been with for a long time. I resigned from a leadership postion because of unethical conduct that would not change from other leadership. We stayed at the church for five months because God would not did not give us permission to leave. When He allowed us to leave, we checked out some churches, prayed over them, but God has put us in a place that is traditional, unfortunately the leadership shows signs similar to our former church. While we are not understanding why God would put us in this type of a situation, we are obedient and are seeking what His will is for us. All this is to just say "Loyalty belongs to God," not denomination, not a church or pastor. God first and always.

What about TRUTH? Does that matter in protestantism today? God's will is that we follow Him --who is TRUTH--even if that leads us in a direction that challenges our prejudiced and bigoted notions . Without the Eucharist --the "medicine of immortality" -- I am afraid that it is difficult to recognize TRUTH-- instead we follow "comfort", "community" and emote our way from church to church.

Seek the TRUTH and you will be set free from the semantics and silly justifications of staying with a church that is wrong. To be steeped in history is to cease to be protestant. How about studying the early church or whether Jesus --the lamb of God --truly gave us his body to eat so that we would have life in us!!!
http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/1990/9002frs.asp
http://www.chnetwork.org/converts.htm

There seems to be an subversive undercurrent to this post that suggests, in good old North American fashion, that the individual's perspective is always correct. Sometimes from a church's perspective there is no better solution than that disturbers of the peace leave.

I think the sovereignty of God is all that matters. If God says go - then go. If God says stay - the stay. But as a pastor who entered the ministry at age 45 I know a little about the "layman" side of church. Most of the believers I knew and continue to know don't really care about what God thinks. In fact, most would not be able to discern God's voice, because their idolatry to self as quenched the Spirit's voice. Some of that has come through even in the comments I've read on this blog. Who was the "1st church", who is the purest church today, are there more Catholics leaving for Evangelical or more Evangelicals leaving for Cahtolic. I don't think much of this discussion pleases or matters to God. I think what matters to Him is "Are you listening to me?" If the answer to that is "Yes, Lord", then no matter whether we stay or go, we stay or go with God's blessing, and He is pleased.