"Do you agree with Roberts?"

Hmm, let me think about what you quoted him saying..."Because truth is truth. Truth is not relative."

Yeah, I can get behind these "two" (2) sentences.

"And should more churches be seeking alliances with neighboring congregations of other faiths while holding on to their doctrinal differences?"

Hmm, doctrinal differences...interesting...

How bout complete and total theological differences?
How bout complete and total world view differences?
How bout complete and total exegetical differences on what is truth?

You see, when you limit the question to "doctrine" you make any sort of disagreement...petty, and narrowminded...which, me being a follower of Y'shua...yes, in terms of what the truth has been revealed to me vs what the world sees as truth, I am narrowminded.

Me thinks you need to expand your question a wee bit.

As for Mr. Roberts and his decision...I don't know enough about him or his motivations. So I find it difficult to make a call as to whether this outreach of his is a good thing, or another form syncretism.

Well it is fascinating to see the logic of a shepherd who willingly walks his sheep before the wolves.

We don't worship the same God as Muslims. We don't recognize the fulfillment of God's plan with the Jews. In terms of worship we must remember that if we don't share Christ in common than we cannot share anything about God in common.

I'm all for helping people learn about other religions but this could be done better. We need to recognize the biblical doctrine of primary separation here. The Gospel should never share space with paganism.

Sure, why not go the whole way and worship with Satanists too !!

While I understand what Mr. Roberts is trying to do, the problem is that as Christians, we don't just worship God. We worship God as revealed in Jesus Christ. Revelation says that those who are worshiping around the throne of God worship the Lamb that was slain. Philippians tells us that at the name of Jesus, every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

It's not that we SHOULDN'T worship with Muslims and Jews. It's that we CAN'T, because in their rejection of Jesus as Lord, they are unable to worship in the New Testament sense.

Having said that, I have no problem with more interfaith dialogue. But let's call it what it is--dialogue, not worship. I have no problem with attending a Muslim or Jewish religious service with the intent of understanding their worldview, and perhaps even gaining insight on some aspect of truth that can be found in those worldviews. But that is not worship. It cannot be.

Standing in a room and witnessing a worship service doesn't seem harmful in and of itself, and I also like Roberts' take on the dialogue between faith. He's not taking the well-worn and quite flawed path of "lets talk about what we have in common!" That approach is condescending and insulting to any serious person of faith. But looking a dear friend of another faith in the eye and saying, basically, "I completely disagree with you, but I love you and respect you," is a very powerful idea.

Regrettably, the title has led some to a false assumption that they are experiencing "joint" or "common" worship.

Agree or disagree with the idea, that is not what Bob has said.

I interviewed Bob about his motivations and the experience here.

You may think this is a bad idea (and I interviewed him because I had my concerns), but let's be sure to understand what he was trying to do. I ask and then Bob explains:

Why attend the worship service of other religions? Can you really worship with Muslims?

Missionaries around the world do this to understand the people they're trying to communicate with. It was an educational event. I don't view it as "satanic" or "demonic" these are people that are sincere and seeking God. Going into bars, movie theatres, and banks are probably a lot more "satanic" than anything else! I want to know how they think, etc., Paul did it in the synagogue and at Mars Hill. Those people who are seeking God the most, are the ones I want to relate to. I want to be like Paul in this regard.

Worshipping with Muslims? At first I would have said no - but worship isn't about the space it is "the hearts affection and the mind's attention" as Jordan Fowler says - so I can worship anywhere, anytime, anyplace - as long as I am right with God and my focus is directed toward God the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. In my car, in my study, in a mosque, in a catholic church, in a synagogue, on the side of a mountain, in an airplane - the Holy Spirit doesn't leave me when I walk in places he goes before me and guides me into those places as long as the primary focus is to glorify God.

The question is, do I focus my worship to the God of the Jew or Muslim or whatever? The answer to that is no. I believe as I stated several times the past weekend that I believe that Jesus is God in the flesh. I cannot worship if I deny who Jesus is. Jesus is greater than all religions, and all gods. If he's in my heart - I'm filled with the Holy Spirit - and "if I make my bed in hell - he is with me."

So, it might be helpful to discuss what Bob believes rather than what the eye-grabbing title might lead some readers to assume.

And, let me also add that Bob does not like interfaith dialogue (as mentioned in the subtitle). He calls for multi-faith, which he thinks is different.

Again, he explains:

How is this different from liberal Protestant approaches at interfaith cooperation? I'm not a particular fan of interfaith events. It takes all religions and tries to merge them into a "all roads lead to the same place" kind of approach as well as mixing worship to multiple gods thereby denying the truth of most views of God. At the synagogue they did their worship and we observed, at the mosque the same and at the church the same. Interfaith is mirky, it's more about feel good. It doesn't allow us to be honest about our differences. It's build on the premise of the lowest common denominators of our belief of God so we can all sit down together. How can we build relationships if we don't speak honestly to each other. I'm tired of having to be religiously politically correct. I'm also tired of the arrogance of some evangelicals who don't know how to disagree and treat others with respect.

Sorry to complain about the title/subtitle so much. A title can be technically correct but lead to wrong conclusions. Complicated stories require more detail for good discussion.

God bless,

Ed Stetzer

Seems like the three paragraphs after my first question to Bob lost the indent. Those three paragraphs were his answer.

As a person who received some further theological education at a school that stands squarely in the "liberal" tradition, i can say too that the liberal academy is highly critical of the "lowest common denominator" approach to "inter-faith" or "inter-religious" dialogue.

but we'd know that if we bothered to actually seek out and listen to what the "liberal" scholars are actually saying.

seems like evangelicals need to do some "intra-faith" dialogue first before they think about muslims, jews, etc. et. al.

I wonder if Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego are shaking their heads right now?

My opinion: No Jesus = no truth in an ultimate sense.

When different faith groups decide to "focus on what we agree on and unite around that" ... if Jesus is absent and you're united around something less, you're uniting around something other than God.

Yeah, more people may show up to your ice cream socials, but is that really what the mission of the church is all about?

I feel sad for the Jews and Muslims who attended the "worship" service at the protestant church. They witnessed an event that in no way resembles anything the scriptures specifically calls for except for maybe -Let us consider how we can program expert driven one-way communication oriented expression of truth, not forsaking the assembly as the habit of some is, but sitting in close proximity to one another, and all the more as we see the Day approaching. It would have been great for them to see supernatural spiritual organism expression of truth as the body of Christ is capable of doing. It's possible the Muslims and Jews gathering more accurately expressed their holy writings than the protestants.

Could someone remind me where in the New Testament that the early church did this?

Our leadership team just went to the local reformed Jewish synagogue. We didn't go to worship together. We went as a cross cultural experience. I'm also attending Passover on March 29th.

The roots of Christianity run deeply in the Jewish tradition.

I'd much rather go to a synagogue where no one is pretending we are all the same than to an ecumenical service where everyone buries their head in the sand and pretends we all agree.

Grace Freak

Dan Rockwell
http://gracefreakdan.wordpress.com

Most churches I've been to don't preach Jesus - they preach becoming better people. So if you do away with Jesus it's pretty easy to come to agreement on similar moral grounds.

This is just the natural progression of the "Christ-less" church goer.

I am grateful for what Bob Roberts is doing, even before I read Ed Stetzer's clarification above. To listen to someone lovingly is something I believe I should excel at as a Jesus follower. Thanks Bob.

Bob Roberts did not "coin the word" glocal (as the article implies). The word "glocal" was coined by Langhe in the 1980's, and popularized by Roland Roberson in the 1990's.

I'm glad Ed stepped in here. Good clarification.

"seems like evangelicals need to do some "intra-faith" dialogue first before they think about muslims, jews, etc. et. al." - nathan

Nathan, you let the cat out of the bag.

"As the Father has sent me, I am sending you." John 20:21

"...you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth." Acts 1:8

A Muslim once remarked of Christianity that "where you get ten Christians you get eleven different sets of opinion."

Evangelicals today seem to have stuck in the mud in their evangelistic uphill climb inside "Jerusalem." With the formidable challenge of the ecumenical rugged mountain ranges of "Judea and Samaria" which they have still to surmount, I wonder if they can ever pitch their tent on that vast unexplored wild expanse of territory that stretches "to the ends of the earth."

Not a comment on the presentation, but the lack of a print-friendly button for my technically-challenged wife like most of the CT sites.

Interesting - especially the comments. In Stetzer's response he mentioned the Synagogue. Did not Paul make that his first port of call for the Gospel? Before he got his chance to speak did he worship with them - the Jews - despite them not recognising Jesus as the sole mediator between God and man? Looking forward to what your readers think?
Rob Ferguson

Dear Ed Stetzer

I find it strange that christians can worship with Muslems in their place. That is a miracle. But again you stated that we must see it in as learning from them. If this is correct Why are many missionaries killed in Islamtic countries??

I'm no expert and have more questions than answers. But didn't Jesus say, "The Father and I are one" and "If you've seen me you've seen the Father"? Could it be that anyone who worships the one true God is also worhipping Jesus? If that's so wouldn't that be a wonderful starting spot when talking with people of differnet faiths? One could say like Paul did, "Let me tell you about this God you worship..." other faithsWhether they understand that or not?

Additionally: Wouldn't Muslims and others be better served with a more complete understanding of who God is?

Truth is truth and is not relative. However revelation is progressive. In the fullness of time God sent forth His Son Jesus Christ. In the last days I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh. These two will never contradict each other or divide true worshippers of God the Father.
By all means lets talk with out compromise.

Well from reading all of the comments - I'm stunned at how facts don't matter. Read the articles on the glocal.net, listen to the sermon, etc. - I proclaimed the gospel clearly multiple times to an audience where most have no relationship with Christians at all let alone been in a church or encouraged to befriend a Christian. The Great Commission wasn't a suggestion but a command.

Please don't get in your car - some Satanist, Mormons, Hindus, and a Baptist or two probably worked on it.

Christian truth can stand in the public square of other religions - I don't have to count on isolation and ignorance of other faiths to keep disciples strong - just good teaching and the practice of the faith.

The Gospel exploded in pagan space because Christians were there (Paul at Mars Hill) in the public square sharing it. Daniel was able to do the same, even serve, and had a powerful ministry not outside of government and king but inside it. The Kingdom resides inside the person - not the infra-structures of the church or her power structures of control.

The biggest wolves I worry about are not those outside my faith - but those inside it - much like Jesus warned and Paul dealt with with the Judaizers.

Shadrack . . . . are cheering - they worked for a king who didn't believe in the God of the Old Testmant , didn't compromise their faith but were able to speak into his life.

Now here is what concerns me when I read these comments: the ignorance of the church of the world and it's global context, the isolation of the western church from other religions out of ignorance (you don't find that in the global church), the inability to build relationships on mass scales that have the inability to influence culture, the absence of a passion for the Great Commission.

Go to glocal.net - listen to my interview with Prince Turqi - if the Gospel is to be spread - it will not be done in isolation or villifying other people.

Well, as a Jewish man who became a believer in Jesus some 24 years ago, I have come to understand two core truths when sharing faith with my people. 1.) Don't mention the "J" word. We are always glad to interfaith as long as you don't push the Jesus thing. 2.)We love other faiths as long as they leave us alone and do try to give is their religion. So, are you building bridges that go nowhere when it comes to the Gospel? Yep, I think so. Dialogue about religion is easy, even with our Muslim friends. But tell us that Jesus is the Way? Nope. So, you make the choice, share the hope of salvation, or experience religious diversity without transformation. As a Jew, I plead with you to be light and salt - tell them about their Savior... Please!

I agree that truth is truth. It is our reaction sometimes to what each of us hold dear as truth that can become a problem. If I espoused 2+2=5, many would dialog with me and express their understanding that2+2=4, but I doubt that hostilities would break out over our differences. We must be able to hold firm to our faith, and allow others to do the same. We should even be able to evangelized to each other and end up agreeing to disagree, without becoming diagreeable.

"Now here is what concerns me when I read these comments: the ignorance of the church of the world and it's global context, the isolation of the western church from other religions out of ignorance..."

Perhaps, Bob, you should not assume things, as I have not with you, until you have more information to make such a declaration.
As for communication...we have plenty of that...a pity, as is mentioned...that its just words.
But do this, I dare you...tell them, "Jesus is the way, the truth, the light, no one comes to the father but through him."
Then come back and tell me how that dialogue is going.

If you listen to the sermons for the weekend at glocal.net or northwoodchurch.org you will hear me quoting John 14:6 and explaining why we believe that as evangelicals. That was the first question I was asked in the dialogue did I really believe that Jesus was the only way, by a Jewish lady no less! "My answer was yes - I do and because I do that means that of all people as followers of Jesus we should be most loving and open to share the message. The dialogue is growing Rev. Perry - the women are doing a cooking class - Kosher, Hallal, and Lard (what we eat in the south) and we are building houses together in inner-city areas and talking about our differences one on one. There's a big difference on multi-faith and interfaith. Interfaith says I dummy it down where we can all agree. Multi-faith says there are fundamental differences in our faith that are irreconcileable but the best of my faith teaches me that I should still respect you and build a relationship with you. One thing I know for sure, I cannot lead someone to faith in Christ I do not know or have a relationship with.

"There's a big difference on multi-faith and interfaith."

It is good that you understand the difference...but I have found that organization discussions and relationships, regardless of how low the bar of expectations is set, fail miserably compared to the one on one relationship bulding between two individuals.

I think you are going to discover that multi-faith is a long road in a waterless desert to a clearly marked dead-end, but my words mean nothing to you, so I leave you to G-d to find out whether what I'm saying is true or not.

I wonder if the kingdom of God would be better served if we stopped putting words into Jesus' mouth. I don't find anywhere where Jesus said, "I am the ONLY way to the Father." That's how some, maybe most, interpret what Jesus said. But what He said was: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6, NIV) Could it be that what Jesus meant was that without His sacrifice on the cross no one, absolutley no one, can come to the Father? But because of His sacrifice the barrier has been removed and now everyone, absolutley everyone has access to the Father?

Everyone throws the "word" truth around like they and they alone have a corner on "the truth." Us Christians have our "truth," the Jews have their "truth" and the Muslims have their "truth." Again, I don't think it serves the kingdom of God well when myslef or others put words in Jesus' mouth. Jesus simply said, "I am the way and the truth..." Jesus is the truth. Not how I interpet the Scriptures or what I say or what someone else may say. Jesus and Jesus alone is the truth. Period!!!

I'm not so arrogant and prideful to think that my understanding is the "only" right and "true" understanding. Because for right now, I but see through a glass dimly. Maybe if the Christians, the Jews, the Muslims and people of other faiths felt the same way, then the kingdom of God would be better served and the world more like what God wants it to be.

For right now, I'm just going to go and make disciples and leave who gets in and who is left out up to God. Maybe the "other sheep that are not of this sheep pen that Jesus must bring also" (John 10:16) are the Jews, the Muslims and all those who eventually come to know and love the one true God that Christ came to reveal to all of the world.

May the ever lasting love of God, the forgivenss of the cross and the hope of the empty tomb spir you on to love your neighbors as yoursleves. Whether they be Jewish, Muslim or whatever...

"seems like evangelicals need to do some "intra-faith" dialogue first before they think about muslims, jews, etc. et. al." - Nathan

Nathan, there's more to your words above than meets the eye.

"...to preach the good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight to the blind, to release the oppressed..." Luke 4:18

Mahatma Gandhi, Indian and Hindu, said, "I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ."

"Even if faith in Christ reaches hearts and minds, the negative connotations associated with the image of life in Western society (the so-called Christian society) present a considerable obstacle to the acceptance of the Gospel." - Pope John Paul II, "Crossing The Threshold of Hope"

"Third world Christians do not need Karl Marx to realize that a 'class struggle is going on.' Knowing that they are oppressed is not something gleaned from books; it is gnawing hunger in the gut, family members taken off at 2 A.M. to face torture and death, children growing up so malnourished that permanent brain damage results, and the realization that 80 percent of their people live in unredeemed poverty while the rest live in unimagined opulence.

"It is not hard for them to figure out who the oppressors are. They are the little handful on top who have the wealth and power - meaning guns, tanks, and torture chambers - to stay on top and keep the rest on the bottom.

"As they reflect on this situation, third-world Christians go a step further. They see that the modern pharaohs couldn't continue in power without help from outside, and they see much of that help coming from the United States of America - help that enabled the Somoza family to maintain dictatorial control of Nicaragua for forty years, that has kept Pinochet in dictatorial control of Chile for ten years, that has continuously legitimized Marcos' dictatorial control of the Philippines and that has supported innumerable dictatorial juntas in El Salvador and Guatemala. They see the United States consistently supporting dictators all over the world..."

- Robert McAfee Brown, "Unexpected News: Reading the Bible with Third World Eyes"

Charity begins at home. Western society needs help. As Bill Bright, Founder of Campus Crusade, wrote in his book "Renewing the Soul of America":

"As a country, and as individuals, we stand at a crossroad - to continue on the path to godlessness, or to return to the way of righteousness."

Correction:

Charity begins at home. Western society needs help. Bill Bright, Founder of Campus Crusade, graces prominently the front cover of Charles Crismier's book "Renewing the Soul of America" with following forewarning:

"As a country, and as individuals, we stand at a crossroad - to continue on the path to godlessness, or to return to the way of righteousness."

I am reminded of Daniel and his faith. Surely he was in the dock. He could have find his way out of the situation to suit the humanly conveniences. But no, he knows his GOd is holy and he has to do it in a holy manner. The problems and inconveniences in the world is not new. It is a cycle of peak and low problem situation. May be Daniel and this generation is in one of the peaks.
The mission of our Living and Loving God must be done in holy and God's ways.
Not in the convenient ways this world and this generation can think of.
I do not agree with Pastor Robert.

Talking is talking. Worship is worship. Learning about their beliefs and experience of faith would be good. Sharing the Gospel with them would be wonderful (we know we should, but never find a venue for it). But I would be careful not to imply that the event involves worship of what would be different deities. The God of the Bible shows undeserved favor in His Son, while all other religions are about finding favor with god through human performance and devotion.

I wonder how many of those who are replying so succinctly against this approach have ever actually been to a Synagogue or Mosque? It is hard to have any understanding of what, exactly this Pastor is doing if you weren't there, or haven't experienced anything like it. Also, what's up with all the name-calling among Christians? Why do we assume the intent of "liberal Christians" when they dialog. Now, we CAN and SHOULD have a conversation about the rightness and wrongness of approach. Here's what I'd like to add to the conversation:

During my education to become a pastor I took a class (not required mind you) called World Religions. This class was typical in that we read excerpts and wrote papers analyzing the primary texts of other faiths, and thought and debated (dangerously at times) the other "world religions" from the outside or at best perspectives of former insiders telling us "how it is in there." All this work was of minimal benefit to me.

But one extraordinary thing did happen. The professor took us on a weekend trip to meet with, walk through, and LISTEN to others as they practiced, debated, and at times proselytized us to their faith. Dangerous? Perhaps. But since when is following Jesus the safe Way?

The result was a resounding affirmation of the Truth I have found in Jesus the Christ. The result was a real, deep, and profound understanding of the lack of Solution offered by these proselytizers. The result was that not only did I grow in my own faith, but I actually realized that there is nothing to fear in the "big bad world" out there, that all I need I have found in Christ, and that I can dare to engage for the sake of lost souls and the benefit of His Kingdom.

But then again, I risked it...I went there...and I had someone lead me who was not afraid to go.

Worshipping with Jews and Muslims ,may not be possible,as Muslim consider Jesus like a messenger and not the son of God,so the very basic of Christian faith is not understood,similarly Jews have not recognised Him as the saviour of the world and the son of God.
Roots may be common but, there is differences in understanding of Christian faith and therefore it may not be possible to worship with Jews and Muslims.
On the other side why there have been so many killings of Christian believers in Islamic states?
Do they (Muslims & Jews ) also think on the same lines of Mr.Bob Roberts.