Brandon:
Your blog post made me think about some of the things I've found myself doing. I'm a worship leader at my church. Sometimes during our worship, we have moments where the Holy Spirit really moves the congregation. Other times, he just brings peace. It would be "pagan" of me to think that I can move God by performing a certain song or playing it over and over, or even playing it a specific way. God chooses the times when he brings the refreshing; I can only be receptive and allow Him to work without getting in the way. Thank you and God bless.

Right on, Brandon. I think it is a natural tendency given our need to control our environments. But, then, crucial to our relationship with God is our willingness to submit to His plan.

Really good insights, Brandon! I think at various stages in our faith we all struggle to grow out of this way of viewing God, and sadly many continue to view Him this way well into what ought to be a more mature Christian faith in adulthood. Certainly some popular "Christian" theologies tend to feed it--the obvious "health, wealth and prosperity" teachings, for example. But even believers in much more mainstream Christian traditions can find themselves confused about this. Having become an Orthodox Christian in adulthood from an Evangelical background, I'm also sensitive to the way people sometimes assume a more liturgical and sacramental expression of Christian faith is an attempt to appease or manipulate God (this is far from the reality in Orthodox teaching), so I appreciate the way you point out that Evangelical rites and prayer forms can be misunderstood and misused in the same way. Thanks very much for this post.

Brandon,
I agree with your blog post, however I would hesitate to limit God's activity to that which is solely out of love. God does act in agreement with Love, but that is only one attribute, in truth He works in accordance with His Being and essence and that involves all His attributes. Scripture tells us that God must be true to Himself (He cannot deny Himself 2 Tim 2:13). We are to worship Him in truth. If I were teaching this I would say that the God we worship acts in accordance with His nature and one aspect of that nature is love.

Preach it brother. This statement is probably more radical than most will realize:

"the relationship between God and humans is not based on rites, rituals, and incantations"

The ritual tradition is Christianity is, I suspect, at root a kind of hypocrisy. It is inherited from paganism and then interpreted (sometimes profoundly) in Christian categories. A case of NOT throwing the baby out with the bathwater (apologies for the unfortunate imagery).

Well, I certainly agree that believing we can manipulate God using rites, rituals and incantations is wrong-headed. At the same time, there's a rich tradition within both the Jewish and Christian traditions of using ceremony--not for God's sake, but for our own, to help us humans with our pitifully limited five senses get a small scent, sight, glimpse, touch and taste of what God intends for his Kingdom. Breaking bread, the most central ritual in the Christian faith, is a re-enactment of Christ's final days with the Disciples, a binding of the faith community and a foretaste of eternal life.

Thanks, all, for your comments.

Stephen, I particularly appreciate your comment. I certainly agree with you that rites and rituals are important for the Christian life--two in particular: baptism and communion. You are right to point out that these are meant as means of communicating divine realities to us worldly humans. I value these things very much. My concern is simply when we begin to view rites and rituals (and piety and prayer, etc.) as means of manipulating God. I do not believe that rights, rituals, piety, etc., are dangerous in and of themselves.

BY FAITH ALONE
by
THOMAS SEATH
2nd September 2010 A.D.

Dear Sir, I am writing to ask for your help, in this matter....I do a lot of work with unsaved sinners every week and for the past 18years, and many of them are alcoholics and addicts and their families.

How ever cheerfully enough I get one given to me by God's Grace, who is just an unsaved sinner.

This chap however wants to know the answers to every thing, before he committs to anything, which is not so refreshing; and he asks a lot of questions like these ones of - what is God like? and or what is Jesus like? and this one of...If a person who turns himself and his life over to God in Jesus Christs names, and is then baptised in the name of Jesus Chruist and becomes a born again sinner type, saved by grace - Is his sins washed away or not? and if so which ones? is it just the ones with the police record or is it just the ones wth out the police record? or does it not matter at all as to whether they were caught or not, as long as their former sins are washed away? and or gthis one of.....you say - that once a person is born again, that he and she is then Justified By Faith Alone and can rightly call on the name of Jesus Christ to be your Lord, Master, Protector, Mediator and Justifier, King and Prophet and that all of your former sins, current sins and future sins are washed away in the blood of Jesus Christ...HOW THEN – can you ask a person to provide any kind of evidences of their former sins (if they have one on the police files or not)? Well that one got me....

I myself cannot find any evidence in Scripture where God deliberately says “Before you can become a Christian Biorn Again type, that you must provide my ministers, priests or elders a list of your former sins, let alone future sins....”

And I myself cannot find any where in Scripture being God's Holy and unchangeable Word, cannot find anywhere, where God deliberately says Once you are a born again man or woman – that you must provide further evidences of your former sins, let alone future sins.

And I myself cannot find anywhere in Scripture – where God deliberately states that before any born again man, has to provide any kind of evidences of their former sins before they can be nominated and elected into office of the Ministry of the Word and Sacraments of God.

And I have been putting off making any further comments on these points till I can get more concrete evidences and perhaps you can help me to find them.

His questions have stirred up in me a hornets nest of controversy to do with, Justification by Faith Alone in Jesus Christ's name verses Police Checks.....being required and demanded in God's Church.

Please Sir, if you can help me, then help me on this matter as soon as possble.

I live in a small country town in South Australia where Christianity and Christian worship practices has run amok....and every one I have spoken to about this has turned against me and saying about me that I am a divisive man, and a schism maker...but I'm not...I need to be able to answer this man I am mentoring and myself as well on this now urgent matter.

Because there is no such Bible verses any where that I can see for myself. In fact the opposite is true...I can find every kind of evidence which says...no, we cannot ask any one of a brief of their former sins...just see the Lords Prayer for example “Our father which art in heaven, hallowed be thy name, thy kingdom come – THY WILL BE DONE (where), ON EARTH, AS IT IS IN HEAVEN.” And where He himself says “I WILL REMEMBER THEM NO MORE, AS FAR AS THE EAST IS FROM THE WEST.” And this one 'YE ARE A NEW CREATION ALL THINGS ARE PAST AWAY.'

Sincerely, Tom Seath.

ps, sorry about the typing errors I'm nearly sixty...maybe thats why...smiles.

A new book, The Christian Atheist, by Craig Groeschel addresses some of these "pagan" ways. The byline of the book is Believing in God but living as if He Doesn't Exist. A lot of us in the Sacramento area will be studying in homes and in churches together. It looks good.

Sheerahkahn, istm Brandon has merely oversimplified for the sake of his point what is at the root of much of pagan religion as process (i.e., a form of humanism), which he ultimately points out is simply to put confidence in human effort and in methods or rites per se, rather than in the wisdom and love of a transcendent God, Who personally understands our heart and responds out of His wisdom to our needs. This isn't, and isn't intended to be, an expose of all the particulars of pagan religion. On the other hand when you say that pagans seek to "restore the functions of nature to their proper course" and to "maintain a state of harmonious balance" by propitiation of their gods, it's hard to see how this contrasts in any way with the understanding that pagan religion is a form of manipulation, i.e., human effort expended to influence the "gods" as forces of nature. Perhaps you were intending to make a distinction between the real goals of most pagan religion and those of Brandon's observation of a "paganized" Christianity, where the latter might be more concerned with appeasing the anger of a "holy" God and getting rid of guilt for personal sin, which would be foreign to much of pagan religion. That distinction would certainly make more sense.

Brandon, I understand what you are saying and in essence I agree but since GOD has a different relationship with each one of us as we are different from one another.... consider a man from the turn of the 19th to 20th century...Rees Howells.... not to mention Abram and many others in history...sometimes it is this for that.... there are exceptions...but YES, you are correct in the spirit of what you said and theologically speaking.
Blessings always, in HIM

Thomas,

It is great to hear that you are doing the Lord's work in the way that you do it. Your question seems a little off topic and noone seems to be helping you so I thought I'd pitch in.

I note that there were requirements put in place by Paul that Bishops had to have converted a long time ago and have a good reputation. They are even precluded from that ministry if they have remarried or drink alot (among other things). Serious crime would presumably be relevant to reputation and in a large society like ours with modern transport enabling people to travel long distances quickly the police record would be the only realistic way of checking that aspect of the reputation.

Nevertheless I doubt you will find anything completely on point in the scriptures. I believe that a Bishop is a step up from being simply a Pastor.

That doesn't mean that your mate can't be truly forgiven by God as you have amply established with the scriptures. Nevertheless you will not easily find support for bringing someone in with a poor reputation.

We live in a very secularised society and tend to err on the side of caution.

In the past (and hopefully to a lesser degree in the present due to things like police checks) pastors have joined Churches who were not 'fair dinkum'. Indeed in a number of cases, that the largely secular mass media relish so much, pastors have actually interfered with kids. Other less dramatic things have happened such as pastors taking off with Church money or simply misappropriating huge amounts over a period of time.

The point is that God doesn't use the words "police check" in the scriptures but it is hard to imagine that the safeguards will be relaxed any time soon given the history of the past couple of decades and the enormous force it has been (when gleefully overemphasised in the media) for turning people away from God in droves who might otherwise have the opportunity to be saved.

Whether or not someone is forgiven by God we need to be our brother's keeper and can't contribute to pontentially feeding them to the wolves due to our imprudent behaviour when choosing pastors.

God Bless

It sounds to me like the false teachers we hear on the television. Those who say we can demand from God if we ask right. Or God has to answer your prayer. If you do not know who I am talking about it isn't difficult to figure. They dominate a couple of "Christian" channels.

If you are sick if you have enough faith you can heal yourself.

Sounds like we have been or have elevated our selves to God status.

Pagan worship?
""The Pagans were not "manipulative" in their "appeasements" of their deities, rather they were seeking to restore the functions of nature to their proper course.""
I live and work among Asian animists. Functionally spirituality is like the mafia. If payments are made and rituals performed, etc., then yeah, there is "harmony". But people are constantly afraid of getting out of harmony with Don Corleone. An 'unharmonized' deity, spirit, godfather etc. is not a pretty thing.

God is free...totally! I am thankful that one of the greatest gift He gives us is a taste of that same freedom...from manipulation - either way.

Hi, just wanted to point you to some excellent Christian resources on dealing with infertility. One of the models of Natural Family Planning has proven exceptionally helpful to couples who are struggling to conceive--it tracks the changes in a woman's cycle and identifies the symptoms that indicate the most fertile time of the cycle--but it also identifies hormone problems and other things that can be undermining your efforts to conceive. I know lots of people who've been helped. Check these links:

http://hliamerica.org/news-commentary/naprotechnology-a-new-approach-to-womens-health-and-infertility/

http://www.creightonmodel.com/

All the best to you and your wife!

Tom,

Any time you find your spirit troubled, stop to look at the source. Your commitment-wary friend is looking for a way out of trusting Christ until he understands. The criticism of the church is a red herring drawn across the path to confuse the scent, distract from the heart issue, both for you and for him. The question becomes extraneous when brought face to face with God. (Isaiah 6) Your friend thinks he's looking for answers, but in so doing, he's avoiding looking at God. When he finds God he will find his answers (eventually). (John 3) Without faith it is impossible to please Him and He is a rewarder of them who diligently seek Him. I AM must first be given the right to be his God. You get to know Him by trusting Him. Don't let yourself or your friend be distracted. Your friend knows the facts he needs to know. Now he needs to confront his unbelief.

May God give you wisdom and quiet confidence.

There are only two religions. The true religion and the false religion.
The false religion is manipulating God and his laws to get you want.
The true religion is telling God that you are without hope and are placing yourself in his hands for him to manipulate you forever.
Wayne Searfoss
martyrcall.es.tl

Tom, as you already know, we serve a God of love and grace. what does forgiven mean? forgive means to pardon, excuse.forget. I find it sad when the church wants to hold someones past against them. Yet God won't. We talk of reputation for being a preacher, pastor so forth. If our past determines how God can use us, then who can truly be used? Let him without sin cast the first stone. Paul was a murderer, yet became one of the greatest apostles. Can satan have power over God? NO he cannot. The past is gone as far as the east is from the west. The old man is dead, we become a new creation, no past. God does not care about a man or womans past, for he knew everyhing we would do already before we surrendered to Him. Your friend should totally surrender to God, walk in faith. Stay in a position where we can always hear Gods voice in our lives, and wait on Him. If the sins of the past are brought in place to determine our anointing, calling, then there is no forgiveness, and i just won't believe that way. No one is without some kind of past, which in turn would mean no one is qualified for any ministry. And that just isn't the case. Your friend should take his focus off of the past and put it on God. For God DOESN'T remember our past. This issue with your friend is a tactic of distraction. May God Bless yoi and bring you wisdom.

Very well illustrated Brandon. This is something 'Christ-followers' should read and re-read as we 'do ministry'. I once heard a man (considered 'mentally-challenged') give a '4th day report' after a DeColores weekend that went;"sometimes I think I'm on the 40 yd line and God wants me back on the 20 yd line?". We all knew how astute his thinking was!

Robert Bagley

Quickly, Brandon, you are right on target. As someone who has been unemployed for quite awhile, I went through praying harder, searching for unconfessed sins - anything to get a job. Now, though, I have learned the joy of God's presence and provision. WHen He chooses to lead me to job, I'll gladly go, but it's in his time, not mine.
Tom,I have been doing prison ministry for 16 years. Regarding the forgiveness issue. God does forgive completely because He is God and the penalty for our sins have been paid through the death of Jesus. However, the State needs to be paid as well, not because it is greater than God but because no one has paid the penalty. Some beleivers, though, waiting to be sentenced, have seen reduced sentences because they were honest and trusted God. Others who were just as honest and trusting did not see their sentences reduced. But because they were aware of their guilt, knew they were forgiven, and trusted God, they have been able to accept their prison term and even thrive.
The particular gentlemen in question sounds like he is putting up smoke screends. I would guess that there is some sin he doesn't want to give up. Furthermore, he will never understand all things, but he knows enough now to make a choice. This delay indicates something else besides unknowing. I once had a guy that came into the study with question after question. I answered them and gave him additional Bible passages to read. The one night he simply said he was ready. I pray that this man also is ready to believe.

Your post serves to illustrate the basic paradox which underlies human spirituality: God is omnipotent, controlling all things; yet God gave human beings the choice to be free, thereby limiting God's omnipotence. We realize our freedom creates problems (broken relationships, death, pollution of the environment, social injustice, poverty, etc.) so humans create religions to try to make sense of it all.

Christianity reconciles these two poles by introducing a mediating concept: Grace.

Our current generation of Christians isn't the first to fail to understand God's grace in Christ. The Galatians, within decades of Jesus' death and resurrection, had invented new rules of "Christian" acceptability. They told the new Gentile converts that to be Christian they needed "Jesus *and* circumcision."

Current variations of Christian practice are no different from the Galatian situation.

Jesus *and* approved doctrine.
Jesus *and* liturgy.
Jesus *and* lifestyle correctness.
Jesus *and* no __________ (smoking, dancing, long hair, short hair, etc.)
Jesus *and* the Holy Spirit.
Jesus *and* the correct political party.
Jesus *and* blessing by clergy.
Jesus *and* a certain time and place for worship.
Jesus *and* Christian symbols.
Jesus *and* No Christian symbols.
Jesus *and* the correct mode of baptism.
Jesus *and* (anything else that makes us feel like we are pleasing God).

The Lord gives us freedom. We can choose to love and obey and trust Him or we can turn from Him. He still loves us though even when we do doubt Him... we just have to trust Him and know that He is the true God....

This is a great message, out of the ones I've read this is by far the best one yet. In my life this has been an issue, it seems that no matter what I do in life the non-Christians always have things go their way. And even if I pray and get into my Bible and read nothing happens and it frustrates me. But I guess what I need to keep telling myself is that it's not on my time when I want things done. It's when God sees them best fit in my life. God has a plan for each one of us and we need to sit back and let him take care of it. While we continue to grow in our daily life with the Lord.

These are some wonderful reflections made by Brian in this article. Most of us would (or may never have) thought of ourselves trying to appease God or satisfy some notion that we are being punished for some un-confessed sin in our lives (much like the retribution theology held so strongly by Job's friends in his situation). I believe that we as believers can be so quick to read the story of Job and shake our judgmental heads and laugh in mockery at the relentless absurdity of the statements made by Job's friends but yet we continue to live this way on a regular basis. This is a great eye opener and I appreciate the connection to World Religions and the way it is demonstrated that feeling that us humans need to do something to earn someones favor seems to be an innate and universal inclination.

When people talk about Christians being judgmental, this is what a lot of people think of. I agree 100% that we need to start teaching from the pulpit that the only thing needed from people to have a relationship with God is to accept him and to strive to live a life according to his will. We, as Christians, should never carry along with us a sense of pride in how we live our lives. Nothing we do can control what God does but what we should be doing is interceding in prayer, asking God that in all things his will to be done.