The only authority or respect that is real is earned. Everything else is thinly disguised fear and intimidation, hero worship or co-dependency.

People may choose to give us authority on a trial basis but it will quickly evaporate if we're all tell and no show unless they are unhealthy people.

The only real authority in the church comes from the Word...alone.

It is not earned but comes freely to all in His church who will be faithful to Him and His gospel.

That is why I could call you pastor, immediately, and feel no reservations.

I have rarely called any pastor by title but by name. I frankly don't give a rat's tuchas what your title is or what you want it to be. Being a pastor is a gift and sometimes can be a calling. Truth is, many of us function as pastors without the recognition of title and too often without the recognition of those who have the title.

"My authority as a new pastor came from ongoing presence in the community, being faithful to the church despite my insecurities and mistakes." (I love "A" word. It's so...powerful) So what? I think one of the true tests of anybody who has the title is if you are faithful to others despite their insecurities and mistakes. Who cares how they treat you? How do you treat the sheep?

I question anybody who has a title and I highly distrust those who think they deserve one. I've seen too much abusive behavior from those who call themselves pastors or from those upon whom the title is conferred.

Another true test of a gifted pastor is, are you willing to live and work out your calling without ever having the title, without ever being recognized for being a pastor. If so, you may be gifted and called. If not, please get out of the way and find something else to do before you do serious damage to yourself and others.

PBWY,
Aaron

(Pastor) David,

Thanks for your transparency and honesty regarding your journey of struggle regarding this word. For the same time period while operating as a worship director at a multiethnic church in Portland, I was similarly skittish about the term, especially when it was applied to me (using the modifier of worship, as in "worship pastor" made little difference, it still made me shudder).

I've found the word "pastor" to be a very loaded term, loaded with a whole set of cultural assumptions and presuppositions that, when you are operating in a multi-cultural context, can be very confusing and contradictory.

Is the pastor the ultimate authority of the church, whose opinion and sense of calling and discernment is valued almost as much as the Bible itself, whose wisdom and authority is never to be questioned or scrutinized?

Or is the pastor an employee of the church, whose duties are to be supervised by a board or council of elder, whose performance is to be monitored and evaluated, and whose status as a paid religious professional justifies an ever-escalating set of duties and expectations?

I find that without a clear vision in the church and a clearly articulated set of principles that outline the role of the pastor in conjunction with other paid, bivocational or volunteer leadership roles, it's impossible to avoid the cacophony of voices that demand one or the other... and that's not even getting into the whole process of how and when calling is determined.

When I got out of seminary at the ripe old age of 24, they caled me pastor in my first church. I didn't feel like one, but I went with it. In the south, where I'd gone to school, pastors were called "preachers". When I was ordained, and older man in the church would always call me "Reverend", which I wasn't comfortable with. When I told him "Mark would be fine", he explained that he'd been in the Navy during World War II, and out of respect, he NEVER would have called one of his officers by their first name, even after the war was over, when they'd been out of the military for many years. That made sense to me, so I made an exception for him.

I would suggest that if anyone is called into court for any reason, do not call the judge by their first name, or for that matter, "Judge". Or if you'd like, try it and let us know how that works out for you.

"...and they love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues and greetings in the marketplaces and being called rabbi by others. But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brothers. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. Neither be called instructors, for you have one instructor, the Christ."

It is quite common for God's Word to be rendered meaningless when a paycheck, a title, and a permission to dominate a group is to be gained, or permission to be passive and have others do the spiritual responsibilities you don't want to do. Today's religious rigamarole is seen as holy, just like the system in Jesus time.

This is authority driven by traditions of men, not a call of God. God's call is very clear in Jesus words. It thus becomes obvious that the old "obey those who have the rule over you..." are warped translations. You can't have both "rule over" and "not lording over" unless you're good at sweeping one under the rug.

God's grace is greater than our sin, but you don't win the race unless you follow the rules. Someday everyone will grasp the beauty and power of "you are all brothers".

@Tim

I agree definitely that we are all brothers and sisters in Christ, and that He loves us all equally. But i willingly submit myself to those over me, by my own choosing, authority figures in my life who have many years of experience, high character and great wisdom. I do this so that i may grow and be discipled in a very intentional way. Sure they also gain insight from me, but i do belive that it is not at all a bbad thing for one to be 'above' another in that sense, as there are god given authorities in this world, for example, a father to his child. I have many spiritual fathers and mothers who I listen and submit to, trusting thier opinions.

I'm not sure that i have got my point across all that well, but to summarize, do you see the benefit of having people over you who can speak into your life?

Jelani- this paragraph of yours really resonated with me:

I've found the word "pastor" to be a very loaded term, loaded with a whole set of cultural assumptions and presuppositions that, when you are operating in a multi-cultural context, can be very confusing and contradictory.

This has been my experience as well in a multi-ethnic context. As some of the comments have pointed out, some of the way we grant (or not) pastoral authority is related to our theology. But just as often, in my experience, it is related to our own cultural context. My own understanding of pastoral authority has shifted in significant ways as I've had the chance to learn from those whose cultural and historical vantage point differs from my own.

You might be interested to know that this thread has generated another lively discussion over at St.Joseph's Vanguard(http://bit.ly/nmwyG7).

@ Daniel
Thanks for your response. Your point is clear regarding institutionalized faith and pyramid authority thinking.
"…there are God given authorities in this world"
Yes there are, but in the church, Jesus is the head and we are all "members of one another". Jesus said in the great commission, "all authority has been given unto me". The authority He passes on is to EVERYONE to "go therefore and make disciples of all nations…" He has not given institutional / positional / titled authority in His church to anyone. The scripture I give above is very clear He rejects that.

Spiritual maturity does not posses authority, title or position. It chooses that which is lower so that others can be lifted up and "fully trained" to be "like him" Luke 6:40

Brotherliness means mutuality - two way openness for building to go both ways. When you gather and one man does 99% of the personal expression of truth in one-way communication, there is no mutuality or brotherliness. How can you contribute to him here? He considers himself an expert doctor and you an unlearned patient and you like it this way. This is not Christ's design for His body. The clergy can only posture brotherliness for you to feel like it's happening all the while they dominate the meeting. Everything outside the meeting takes it's cues from the meeting.

Oversight, a legitimate Biblical dynamic, is not over-talking, over-visioning, over-bossing, over-thinking, over-managing, over-positioning, over- anything else in the clergy system. It is only oversight. Secondly it is not a "special call from God" to be an overseer / pastor. "ANYONE who desires the work of overseer desires a noble task…"

No believer needs anyone over them to speak into their life. Any brother, sister, even a child can speak into my life, and they do in gatherings set up for mutuality (speaking to one another in psalms, hymns…Eph. 5) the dynamic of being "filled with the Spirit". One-way communication / lecture is the opposite of this.

There is far more man driven corruption in the clergy system. Too much to confront here. Be a Berean who examines the scriptures DAILY to see if what you are told is true… Acts 17:11

David, keep letting the work of the ministry and everything connected to it draw you into an awe over all that God is and all that God can do through you. That is a good place to be. As for some of this noise in the comment section; well, some of it is nothing but noise...no need to listen. God knows.

@Tim

Yeah i definitely agree with you that the system of one man, being the authority of so many, in a church/clergy or whatever context is not how Jesus intended. I find that wrong, and yeah, it really does stunt the growth.

My point is not to have institutionalised leaders over us all, but as you said mutual brothers. Maybe i wasn't clear. I'm pointing more to an older/younger brother thing here. because frankly, i can be a true idiot. I stuff up, yes i do not try to, but i still have desires and passions that may get mixed in with what i believe God is saying, especially as i am really developing as a christian. I choose to have people over me. They did not ask, demand or seek out to speak into my life, but i asked them, as i respect their wisdom, their years and their character. Now you dont have to do this. But i want people in my life, who i can be 100% open and honest with, and realistically that just cant happen with every person in my church or whatever. I know that they can speak into my life, but having people there for you, yes in authority over me, that can correcct me, and yes discipline me. Is godly i belive. I take all that they say back to God, but i still want their input. I hope that i have been clear, its so hard over the internet! :)

Also, if i come across as demanding or angry i am sorry. It's not my attitude at all, i just like lively discussion! Thanks Tim and everyone else for your input and ideas, very challenging!

Sound reflections. Pastoral authority is earned, taken, and granted, though any authority that is established is ultimately a gift. Your words on vocation are helpful, particularly in an age that Eugene Peterson has described as being very hard on the pastoral office. While at first I may have understood my own ordination as a pastor as a choice or as a calling that I pursued, over time I have come to recognize that it is the Caller who has given me every gift for ministry and granted me every success. Thus, my authority is not my own, for I speak on behalf of another who is greater than I.

Women? anyone out there? I'd love to hear a perspective from a female pastor on what it's like to be called "pastor" and pastoral authority. My guess is you've probably had to think about this on another level.

Bro. Mark,
I hope you won't be surprized to know that in, for example, Israel's Army all soldiers and generals call themselves by names. Which does not mean that that Army loses its main purpose - to defend the people and the land much more effectively, than that nations neighbors, does it? I come from the persecuted church environment, in which everybody would be called "brother", regardless of position. There was never a lack of preachers in the churches in spite of anything that happened to any preacher/minister. On another hand, modern church's extremely structured environment cultivates love for the titles, PhDisms and so forth; however, isn't it evident enough that this kind of non-gospel approach to the ministry failed miserably the church itself and this nation in general?

To me the main issue is, "Should anyone bear the title of "pastor"?" Jesus made it quite clear no one should be called "rabbi", "master" and the like. To be a pastor is to have a role, an activity, not a label. Put titles like Rev, Apostle, Pastor, on letterheads and business cards and surely one is into disobedience.

Michael, I was wondering in what verses Jesus made it quite clear that the terms rabbi, master, etc should not be used? I am not a "red letter" only believer, I accept all Scripture to be authoritative. Jesus certainly accepted the Old Testament as He quoted from all of the books except from the book of Esther. So, I'm just curious as to where it is taught that Jesus said that. I read the Bible all the time, and I don't remember coming across that, but of course, I'm far from perfect.