Good stuff. Thanks for sharing it.

Here's another good take:

http://1minutedailyword.com/2012/12/17/psalm-22/

I'm afraid the backlash in the social media has already begun...and that is where the Church is getting hit hard because all it takes is one person (or, in this case, a few hundred) claiming to be Christian writing like an ignorant jackasses, and they are now the most quoted spokes-person(s) for all of American Christianity amongst the social media, and news media.
And nothing gives those jackasses more credibility than having a national figure like Mike Huckabee echoing their collective statements.

I think the best thing we can do as a faith is just say, "This is so messed up beyond belief." and just wag our heads with the rest of the nation in sadness.

Anything beyond that seems to be used against us in the court of public opinion, and the less we say the less likely we'll fan the flames of an already hot fire.

I don't think it's enough to report that a relatively obscure person with the satisfactory politically conservative bona fides was a "counterpoint" to Huckabee (and hasn't Dobson weighed in too with similar silliness?).

(The whole fact that we have to cite those political bona fides as a pathway to be credible is a pretty sad thing, but that's a different topic for a different day.)

It actually would mean something if this advocacy organization that is CT would not play the "journalism" card and simply report the happenings.

It would be and incredible blessing if CT would lend its voice to an unmistakeable public rebuke of commentary that besmirches our witness and the heart of God.

The liberal media will always yell loud and long at any Christian who would dare to oppose their anti-Biblical agenda, so when Huckabee speaks, they will be looking to take his words out of context and they will succeed. Why would any Christian be surprised or upset by this? Are born-again believers not allowed a voice in the public square in the United States of America? What is grossly disappointing to me is that so many folks who would consider themselves 'Christian' are more concerned about popularity with the world than with biblical obedience.

Here is a better representation of what Huckabee actually said, "...then we are asked, well 'where was God?' And I respond that, as I see it, we've escorted Him right out of our culture and we've marched Him off the public square and then we express our surprise that a culture without Him actually reflects what it has become," Huckabee said."

@elegance,

Yes. Because the pressing question of "theodicy" was virtually unknown until the "prayer in schools" controversies of the 60's.

The point isn't the claptrap "persecution" narrative you're pushing. The point is that this tragic moment has turned people toward God, even if it is in the form of negative questioning. And instead of responding with a hopefilled and hopeful word about God and God's heart for all of us, you and Huckabee would rather respond with a sanctimonious version of "Welp, ya kinda deserved it!"

I'm sure that you don't mean this...and neither does he...but that's how you make the truth a lie in the ears of a hearer.

Your point may be true...but that's not the question that's actually being asked.

My only prayer is that Huckabee's comment isn't indicative of how he pastored hurting people when he had a pulpit.

Elegance,

Of course Huckabee is allowed a voice in the public square. No one is denying him that right. But by the same token, Wehner is also allowed to critique Huckabee's comments. Incidentally, Wehner can hardly be characterized as the "liberal media." Regardless, you can't just put out statements in the public square and then cry "Persecution" simply because someone disagrees with your public statements.

By the way, are you saying that disagreeing with Huckabee's perspective is the same as being more concerned about popularity with the world than with biblical obedience? I sure hope that's not what you meant to communicate!

Personally, I supported Huckabee when he ran for President. There's a lot I like about him. But in this case, his comments came across as exploiting a tragedy for the purpose of advancing an agenda. In my mind, his comments are the same as those who exploit this tragedy for the purpose of advancing the agenda of greater gun control. Like Nathan, I'm sure Huckabee didn't mean it that way. But if someone like me, who supports him and knows where he's coming from, understands it that way--well, imagine how it is understood by those who *don't* support him!

I've been a pastor for many years now, and I've ministered to many families going through their own personal tragedies. I understand the desire to respond. But one thing I've learned from the ministry is that sometimes, in situations like these, silence is golden. Sometimes, the less we say, the better.

Pastor Anonymous
"In my mind, his comments are the same as those who exploit this tragedy for the purpose of advancing the agenda of greater gun control."

I'm sad to hear you suggest that pointing people to their rejection of God is merely an agenda item like demanding we be dependent only on government agents for our protection. Yes, the left has this agenda item, but for believers, our mission, our purpose for living should never be said to be merely an agenda item. For sure, those who reject God (and some who follow God) will name call (jackass) etc, for fear that God rejectors won't like us when we state the truth about life and pain and suffering.

When Wehner suggests that Huckabee is only asking for perfunctory prayer at the beginning of a class day is COMPLETELY wrong. Freedom to acknowledge God in the public school or government is what he is asking for. Perfunctory faith is no better than anti-faith. (Actually "anti-faith" is an oxymoron because every worldview requires faith, even alleged anti-faith.) Given the freedom to allow faith expression, the true expression will flow. It doesn't need to be required or systematized. Just give it freedom.

It is bazaar, that once tragedy hits, God's name is suddenly allowed. The Bible can be read by the top government guy. Everyone suddenly bows their head and says a prayer. Does that tell us something consistent with what Huckabee is drawing attention to?

Tim,

Alllow me to clarify my statements. Once again, I don't believe Huckabee was actively trying to push an agenda. I think he was sincere in his comments, and I sympathize to a certain extent with what he said. Or at least, I understand where he's coming from and what he's trying to communicate.

My main point was in my final paragraph: in these kinds of situations, silence is golden. The less is said, the better. Why? Precisely because in the raw emotions that surround such a tragedy, anything that is said--however true it may be, however well-intentioned it may be--is in danger of coming across as manipulative, exploitative, etc.

So, Huckabee's point may very well be a valid one. And I agreed with elegance that he has the right to express his opinion in the public square. But just because one has a right doesn't mean one has to exercise that right. You of all people should understand that. In the vast majority of your comments, you make clear that you believe pastors should follow the example of Paul and deny themselves the right to be paid.

So my problem is not so much with what Huckabee said, although I would respectfully disagree with him on some points. My problem is more with his timing. It was the timing of his comments, so soon after the tragedy happened, that made it appear that he was exploiting the tragedy in order to advance an agenda.

(As an aside, I was impressed with the fact that the NRA remained silent for several days following the tragedy. I think their example should've been followed by more of us. Debates on gun control and the role of God in the public square are necessary, and there will be a time for them in the aftermath of this tragedy. But I think that at this moment, the wisest way to respond should've been simply to pray for the families and allow them time to grieve and to bury their dead.)

By the way, I agree that God's mission is not an agenda item. But make no mistake about it--we as believers are not above turning it into one! A careful examination of Biblical and Church history reveals that we are very prone to confuse our own opinions with God's will. Again, based on the comments I've seen from you on here, you of all people should agree with that!

So, Huckabee has the right to express his opinion in the public square. His right, however, does not make his opinion exempt from being challenged, which is what Wehner does. You may disagree with Wehner. You may agree with Huckabee. That is all well and good; and like I said, that debate can take place. I just think it would've been wise to postpone that debate for the moment.

I hope this clarifies what I was trying to say. Blessings to you!

There is a problem in the United States.
A physical, emotional, spiritual problem that the current quaint argument "less G-d leads to more violence" plasters over and doesn't address fully.
This problem infects pretty much everyone living here, Christian, or non-Christian, and one's spiritual identity isn't really the issue; and that problem is the idea, the notion, the lie that violence is the answer...

"Don't trust the Government, arm yourselves!"

"Bad people do bad things, arm yourselves!"

"Teachers need guns to protect our youth, arm yourselves!"

"Home violence on the rise, arm yourselves!"

This quotes above is quite common fare to hear, and for me as a historian I can understand why non-Christians would think this...they live in fear of tyranny, the live in fear of violence, they live in fear.

But when Christians say the same exact thing...it begs the question that I must ask..."why are Christians living in fear of these things?"

Y'shua called us to be sheep, not lions, but weak sheep; And yet, there are many who follow Y'shua, like that rich young man, who loves them some Jesus, but "those guns are my earthly insurance"...just like the rich young man's wealth was his earthly insurance.

"You're right, violence doesn't solve problems, it just clears them away for the solutions to have a clear field of fire at the targets."

Perhaps, then, we are letting our earthly insurance emboldened our claims of less G-d leads to more violence, rather than G-d's spirit emboldening us to say that living in a violent prone culture has it's drawbacks...but there's a better way. A peaceful way. A quiet way, a way in which our safety is guaranteed for ever.

Until we, the followers of Christ, disciples of Y'shua, and thus, followers of the living G-d can finally embrace peace, love, grace, and mercy as a way of life first...well...the world will never know what peace, love, mercy and grace will ever look like, much less have an example to follow.

Anonymous
Yes, you have clarified. I agree.
The question that pushed Huckabee to give an answer was unfortunate timing. He could have deflected the question. I don't know if he knew the question was coming ahead of time or if it happened off any script requiring split second mental and spiritual processing.